Why do contractors lie

My Account. My Basket 0. Magazine Subscriptions. Zoom icon-zoom-in. Why Do Contractors Lie? Maurice Author. In Stock. Description About the Author More Details. Description Why Do Contractors Lie? If you aren't big enough to take that on without further insulting him, then maybe getting the house completed isn't as important to you as your pride. And control issues. The guy has had a long build with all of that on board. Be sympathetic to that. Focus on the end goal.

My engineer husband is by FAR easier to negotiate with than I am. He's also more level headed - he'll get quiet. I will be very direct I do not, however, raise my voice, call people names, etc. It's probably because I handle the money That being said - such like Martha Stewart learned -it's not the crime, it's the coverup. He needs to tell you the truth, and you need to be able to call him out when he's erred nice way of saying it in a way that works toward resolution - but can still be firm.

My house contracted for 9 months build. It has been 14 months, and landscapes are still not done yet. I was just moving in 1 month ago. He shorted and lowered my two retaining walls without consent so, which was made my concreted driveway shorter for his benefits.

He collected draws and fees without showing receipts for upgraded from "allowance". He substituted my three cast-iron tubs for his Americanist tubs without telling nor credit me back. He did not credit what I paid on my own. He did the deck not as shown on plans. He did not cleaned the house as he should. But, I did still pay him all excepted landscapes, grading, and handrails, which he was self deducted from last withdraw.

I told him all problems mentioned above with very light and polite way that I just let you know but no big deal to me although you could do exactly what I asked even cost me more I would be happier, before handed that last withdraw. So, my landscape has not done yet. But I am so happy because, he appreciated my generous and returned by doing excellent job for my grading with water drain ways, and supervised when sub do installed front door hand rails.

I knew the handrail costed more on him. I have the best handrail in that sub for the time being I was asking a question, it was not a statement. Like if there is something I don't know about that is considered acceptable to all contractors? Clearly it was answered as no, but as this is the first and only one i have worked with I wanted to know if it was normal, or just him. And it is true, while I do have an end goal of wanting the house done, it is really really hard to let things slide when we have paid him 3x my salary for one year of work.

And that is ONLY his fee- costs were on top cost-plus contract. I guess I just expected integrity and civility for that price. Silly me for being to literal with my wording in a world where apparently words are more hurtful than actions.

It is clear though, especially from what I have heard, that I am too idealistic. I have decided to go silent and let others be intermediaries as suggested.

Probably more. Do you seriously think that you didn't insult the man? You named the thread "Rant about contractor lies" and then went on to ask a question that we all assumed was rhetorical as it was in a rant about all the lies your contractor told. Now you ask us to believe that you were only asking a question about the standard practice of contractors.

I am dubious that you yourself are not guilty of stretching the truth But giving you the benefit of the doubt, and answering your question I imagine builders are the same as any other business. At times being honest and upfront is profitable and at times being somewhat dishonest and deceptive is profitable and they do a bit of both.

To pretend that any business owes you honesty is being incredibly naive. In fact, there are times where being honest is unethical for a business I know However, I think most contractors find that honesty helps develop trust and trust is essential to their working relationship.

I also think that trust is a two way street and it is hard to analyze the problem without looking at the entire situation. Once the relationship between a contractor and a client is completely blown, it can become a "no holds barred" brawl.

What you really need in a contractor situation is goal alignment. There are ways to find a contractor who is genuinely interested in your project, who shares your goals and who gets where you are coming from. However, many times people use a contractor that they have little rapport with because the money, time or previous work is desirable. Usually breakdowns like this happened at hiring not during the process. Finally, you are tilting at windmills In the end, you have a house to build.

Standing on principle is easy - find an attorney, hand him your checkbook, and teach the contractor a lesson. Sometimes the written word is your one and only friend. To rationalize the lies of a GC as being a result of a persons "communication style" is stupid.

Nobody forced him to make up excuses or deceptively use the wrong doors. On the other hand everybody is right on the money about doing wgat you need to do to finish your build. It is possible to confront someone who has misrepresented relevant facts without using characterizations. Making the issue personal only limits your paths to a resolution. If you can't find a resolution bring in a lawyer and stop talking.

This discussion may be an opportunity for the OP to rant but it raises the important issue of dispute resolution. The alternative to a resolution is to pursue it in a court which is expensive and perhaps inevitable but that is no reason to throw obstacles in the path of a possible out of court resolution. You can always give up and sue. And it has nothing to do with whether a characterization was true or not. The OP needs to find a way to avoid losing money before lashing out at the contractor.

You are dealing with someone who builds for a living and this is not the first time he has been on the wrong side of a dispute. Lashing out at him with insults works in his favor since it gives him a reason to stop work and demand payment. The first thing to review is the contract provisions for correcting work that doesn't conform to the contract, then review the provisions for termination of the contract.

If none of that was properly addressed in the contract, everyone is likely to share in the financial loss and then the ability to negotiate will be even more critical. Don't throw away your options in anger unless you are wealthy and willing to spend money on a lawyer with an unpredictable chance of being reimbursed for your loss.

We've seen this situation many times on the GW, usually when an owner fires a GC before exploring a resolution and then posts the ugly details in search of sympathy. I sympathize with the emotion but not the strategy.

What types of items are on the punch list? Are they big ticket items or small items or a combination? Can you be specific? Honestly, I can see why you are upset. Building a house is stressful.

I still think it will pay to try to get things in perspective and get this over with. Life is too short and all of that This whole process is so stressful, and as ILoveRed pointed out, it will be best to put it all in perspective.

At the end of the day, you want to be at peace as you move into the house that you love. I think that most of us who come here are also simply hoping for the exact same thing, as we trudge through the build process.

In the end, I want to be in one piece, I want my marriage to survive it all thank you, Lord, for the most patient husband who lets everything just roll off his back , and I want to still have a little bit of money in the bank as I sip my glass of wine on my back porch with my dog at my feet.

I swear, some days I think that will never happen I understand the conflict resolution, level headed part of this conversation that JDS is preaching.

But when I'm paying someone 10's of thousands of dollars to do a job and they flat out lie to me, I WILL call them out and I will NOT worry about hurting their "feelings" or insulting them. Is it not an insult to me as the customer to be lied to multiple times and cheated out of materials that I've paid for?

Having said that, I think Bry is right on the money, "trust is a two way street and it is hard to analyze the problem without looking at the entire situation". I also think this comes down to your relationship with your GC. Communication style needs to be established at first meeting. I told my GC during our very first interview that if I had a question, I will ask it, and I will require explanation for things I don't understand.

I explained that just because I question things doesn't mean I think they are wrong, I'm just the kind of person that has to fully understand the "who's, what's, when's where's and why's, in order to feel comfortable making decisions. I made it clear that if that wasn't acceptable, we wouldn't be working together. The first time I was embroiled in a serious dispute was over 40 years ago and someone tangentially involved warned me that anything I said to the other side would be used against me in ways I would regret.

I am simply passing that excellent advice on; aggressively calling someone out for cheating should be left to to your lawyer. I did my due diligence in checking references and interviewing but made the wrong choice. I tried to resolve the issues many times to get him to just finish. Ended up hiring an attorney, he walked out, and I just sat on it for a couple months.

I ended up talking to my cabinet guy who gave me a couple contractors to contact. I ended up hiring one of them to finish and have used them on two other projects. Once the contract was signed the original contractor became completely unprofessional, dishonest, and unethical.

I can't even post reviews because he threathened to sue me for slander, so I am sure he is continuing to do the same to others. He must of had some baggage or issues with dealing with women because he was totally unreasonable. Every day I got home I would get chewed out by him for something. It's not like I was changing my mind or anything, he just wanted someone to scream at. It would be nice to get a "negotiated settlement," but that's not always how the end game works.

Sometimes the contractor just walks away and leaves you hanging, and maybe that's the best thing that could happen for both of you. Escalating the emotional drama is just about the worst thing you can do, and it's useless. Importantly, you want to know whether he has paid all the subs, because of liens. If he has not paid the subs, then he may have screwed up his cash flow, and might be on the verge of bankruptcy.

If he goes bankrupt, you won't get any work or money out of him, obviously. He'll just start another business, under another name. It may not be "fair," but that's the way it often goes. I've been on the other side of this equation, as a sub. There are guys out there who still owe me money, but I'll never get it out of them. I think all the above applies, even if you have a hyper-detailed, ironclad contract.

You can get a mediator, or a lawyer, or a judgment, but in the end, you can't really make this guy do anything he doesn't want to do. You probably can't even get him arrested, as this is a civil contract matter.

OTOH, if he thinks he is "in the right," and is simply seeing red where you are concerned, he will put his ears back and get mule stubborn just to get back at you. It may not be fair, or professional, or whatever, but it is human nature. At any rate, trying to get good work out of someone you hate, who hates you, generally just isn't worth the huge effort and stress, IMO.

But money fixes almost everything. IIWY, I'd document the unfinished work with pictures , figure out the lien situation, and write this guy a "go away and never darken my door again" check. A quick resolution is far better than months of expensive depositions and an unfinished house. Yeah, this is where I am at. It is not worth the money to continue to work with someone I don't trust. I am willing to write a check and see what happens and hire someone else to finish if necessary.

I got a letter from a contractor asking for money in advance of our contractual terms. After I peeled myself off the ceiling, I wrote them back at this point, clear communication and documentation is your friend and enumerated the issues I had with their demand, and specifically asked them to keep working on my project in good faith, as we have worked together to date, and get together to discuss.

I was loaded for bear. I had every eventuality nailed down. The tone of the meeting was VERY different. First they apologized for the aggressive tone of the email and explained how they wanted to manage the payments going forward with, IMO, could still be done within the confines of the contract. What they were asking made sense and I am going to do a construction draw to cover what they want.

We started the meeting mostly saying that we were taken aback by the tone and demand of the email when it was so contrary to every other communication. Bottom line, new project manager was al little pushy, come cash flow issues on that particular side of the business were squeezing them and our project has had more engineering time than they planned. We walked out with continued work, I'll give them money, and we have an installation date for our panels.

In my experience, that's often the case. Too many contractors are running on fumes in terms of capitalization, literally hand to mouth.

Every advance pays the pressing bills, and they are never ahead of the game-- they have little or no cash reserve. One late check, or a job that falls through, and they are SOL. That's when the lying and other craziness tends to start, because they get desperate. I can't tell you how many times a contractor said to me, back in the day, "I'll pay you next week, and a little extra, I've got a good price on this new job Of course, next week rolls around and there's a new excuse.

If I had to pick a contractor these days, I would not go to clients for recommendations. I would talk to the local lumberyards and the subs-- especially the subs near the end of the job, like drywall and painting. These are the folks who often get stiffed, because the contractor has used money that should have paid them, to start up the next job and keep the ball rolling! I should say that not all contractors are like this, some are pretty good business people, and don't extend themselves too far.

But there are too many who might be good at their trade, but can't manage money at all. I can't imagine having a contract that allows the GC to pay the subs directly. We required a Title Company to process our payments to subs, or we pay them directly if they can't wait until our monthly draw is submitted to the title company. The subs sign off on a lien release before they get paid. The only money that goes into our GC's hands is his fee, which was divided evenly by the number of months our contract is for.

This allows us to see every single invoice, for everything from trusses, concrete, to drywall screws. It obviously helps that our GC gets a flat fee, and we don't have a cost plus contract. This way, we're not getting jacked up prices to pad the GC's pockets.

If you think that there is not an easy way that a GC can get a kickback from the subs with the above method of payment, you'd be wrong. Bottom line is that anyone can be sleazy and get around any rules you put in place. Comforting, huh? My comment was in regards to a GC spending up all the money that should go to subs towards the end of a build, as mentioned by scone I'm sure there's a way for a GC to get kickbacks from subs.

The point I was making was that a GC's cashflow problems can't affect the build, with the "rules" we have in place. If the GC doesn't pay the subs I can't imagine the contract could make him responsible for their work in which case he is not a GC but a Project Manager of some sort. This is not necessarily a solution without drawbacks to the owner. Each sub we've used warranties their work for a minimum of 1 year, some up to Whatever draw backs there are that we haven't seen are better than a sub not being paid by the GC and filing a lien against the property, IMO.

The last time I built new, I did a "bank job;" it was a portfolio loan, which is pretty rare these days. Anyway, the bank insisted that my GC produce all the invoices from all the subs, and paid them directly. On the back of the check, below the endorsement, there was legal wording to the effect of: "by signing this check, you are giving a lien release," etc. I can't remember the exact wording. My GC didn't love it, but he had bills to pay, including his carpentry crew, who were unusually employees.

I ended up taking on some of the GC responsibilities, because I couldn't help but hover around anyway, and earned a discount at the end. The bank didn't care, as we came out under budget, and they had another set of eyes looking over the project! So it worked out fairly well. Of course, there was a lot of trust between us, and there really has to be some level of trust when you are doing business. You have to look out for your own interests, of course, but if you come into the situation assuming that the other guy is going to screw you a lot, it can't work.

With all respect to JDS and the other pros here, an inspector, RE agent, builder, or architect is going to think twice before dissing a colleague who is in a position to send them more work. Construction is very much an "I'll scratch your back if you scratch mine" community. It runs on referrals and interpersonal favors, not just overt kickbacks. There is even a certain amount of intermarriage, so it becomes a family thing.

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Anew year holds much promise. Have you ever had an opportunity to be involved in real estate refurbishing in any significant way? Many who have owned homes may have done one form of restoration or another. These are typically one project here, one project there, and may not present major complications.

Those in the real estate rehabbing business experience more turbulence than ordinary homeowners can imagine. The moving parts in an actual rehabbing project are many and varied. For beginners, these parts could take a long time to master.

Without going through the rigorous process of learning, formally or informally, a new business owner may experience unimaginable stress and loss of investments. For starters, rehabbing is the process of restoring and improving a property to a satisfactory or superior condition.

The process can take weeks to months to years depending on the nature of the work to be performed and the exit strategy desired. The exit strategy could involve renting, flipping, wholesaling, or holding for oneself. Your exit strategy determines how many resources you may put into the house and the amount you can make from the endeavor. The big picture of rehabbing a property involves purchase, restoration, and renting or selling. The actual steps involved are many and will become clear as you read on.

Of these steps, hiring a suitable contractor for your specific job represents one of the most challenging parts of the process. Getting the hiring right can mean the success or failure of your job. When you talk to seasoned investors, they will tell you that contractors come in all hues and shades. Some nasty. Some pleasant. Some somewhere in between. Sometimes the ones who look and sound horrible can be the most pleasant to work with.

Sometimes the ones who seem friendly and decent can be the nastiest. In other words, evaluate the personality and the contents of the application. After many false starts and deep disappointments in my business, I finally found my footing. The story of my real estate journey in the next chapter tells it all. At a local real estate meeting in Baltimore, a speaker wishing to develop a consensus of what troubled investors the most in the rehabbing process asked questions to over one hundred attendees.

Captured below are the answers from one of the investors, John Jacobs, which were in line with the majority of the answers from the other investors:. The fact that I keep losing money when rehabbing and also the struggles with contractors during construction. I have researched my problems and have come to realize one of my weaknesses is the wording of my contracts with the contractors. My contracts have loopholes which the contractors exploit.

Many of the lying contractors know how to twist some of the wordings of the contract to get off the hook when they breach the engagement terms. My concern is that I am not running my business efficiently. In fact, in one of my current rehabs, I have fired two contractors. The third one who came with a lot of promise now only shows up twice a week.